Which one, B303 or E303?

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cee21
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Which one, B303 or E303?

Post by cee21 »

Like the title says. The motor is going into my 4x4 b2. May take it to some light to moderate off roading rarely. Mostly will be on street and don't won't to sacrifice power any where for more power some where else. So which one is better low, mid, and high range and which one is more even throughout rpm. Might play some on the street just for a little fun (couldn't do it in high school with that 2.8).
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Dave
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Post by Dave »

What all is going in the motor for heads and induction, manual or auto, gear ratio? Chris has been lookiing for about the same thing as you and has found several better than either of the Ford cams.
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Post by plowboy34 »

As Dave said we need way more info. The E303 will sacrifice some low end no matter what you got but from 2000-6000 rpm it will pull like a freight train.
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cee21
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Post by cee21 »

Right now stock. In maybe a couple of years gt40 intake, bigger mass air, tb, and maybe cobra heads.
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cgrey8
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Post by cgrey8 »

The best cam I've found so far is the Crane Cam Grind 2020 (PN 444211). The problem with this cam is that it has a .530"/.530" lift which exceeds most stock applications without some mods. If you go with aftermarket heads that can handle the lift, this cam runs strong from 1500-6000RPMs. It's far stronger than the E303 thought about being at the lower RPMs. The E303 catches up to it around 5000RPMs. In actuality, the Crane starts rolling off and since it gave up so much at the lower end, it rolls off faster than the E303 does at the top-end which lets the E303 surpass it as you go deep in the 5000s and 6000s.

The next-best cam has been the RM Comp cam advanced 6degrees. It has .510"/.506" lifts and works with stock valves no problem (E303 is .498"/.498"). But because of the lower lift as compared to the Crane, it isn't quite as good of a performer...but there's only a few points difference nothing major, but still LOADS stronger than the E303 at all RPMs below 4500RPMs.

For people replacing the heads with aftermarket heads and wanting a good low-RPM torquey street cam, I'd say don't think 2nd and get the Crane 2020 Cam. But if you plan to run stock heads for a while, but want a better performing cam, the RM Comp is the best I've found so far. It's almost as good as the Crane so later when you upgrade the heads, you can keep the RM Comp cam and still get excellent performance from it (the difference in performance isn't worth replacing the RM Comp for the Crane).

Crane has the 2030 cam which is a higher RPM cam than the 2020 but sacrifices low RPM torque. It's more suited for applciations where the E303 excels...when reving deep into the 6000RPMs.
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Post by cee21 »

The reason why I am thinking about the e303 is for one it is cheaper. About how much is the RM Comp? More than likely though, the motor will stay stock for a while if I put a cam in. Also it says that the e303 has excellent low and mid range power. Is there low and mid range power bands higher than what I think it is? Low 1400-2500 mid 2500-4000 is what I percive it as being. Thanks for any info you can give me, cause if you can't tell I don't know much about picking one out.
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Post by cgrey8 »

I think what they mean by excellent low and midrange power is you don't loose anything you had with the stock cam. You just gain power from about 2500-up. That's quite different than many other higher performance cams that actually reduce off-idle torque as compared to a stock stick. But still not as good as steet performance sticks. The E303 is trying to satisfy a number of different requirements, work with stock components, support superchargers well, CARB certifications for emissions standards, increase power. I have to give it credit, it's doing a lot and doing it pretty good. There are just other cams that do most of these things better. The RM Comp cam is not CARB certified, but it's duration and overlap are considerably lower than the E303 so there's no reason for me to believe it would be the cause of a smog test failure.

Another interesting tidbit, the Crane 2020 cam IS CARB certified for use in California. It exceeds the E303's intentions in every dept EXCEPT it doesn't work with stock equipment.

As for installing with the stock cam for a while, I can certainly understand that strategy. That's exactly what I did.
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Post by cee21 »

So did you replace the cam while it was in the truck and how hard was it? I think I will do a cam later, because I need to spend lots of money on little odds and ends like good header gaskets, bolts, etc. And I could not find that comp cam you mentioned and do you mean advance the timing 6 degrees when it is installed?
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Post by cgrey8 »

I haven't installed it yet. The RM Comp cam is the one I'm going with when/if I ever do the 331 stroker motor I've been talking about for over a year now. So when the cam goes into the motor, it'll be with the motor on a stand. So no, I won't be replacing any cams with the motor in the truck. I'm not about to attempt that.

As for the cam I referenced, it's a Crane Cam. Here's the website for that cam:
Crane PowerMax 2020 (PN 444211).

Comp has a similar cam that's also CARB certified, but it's lower lift and appears to be slightly more aggressive (i.e. not as much low-RPM torque).

The RM Comp cam is the one that can take 6deg advance. When I say advanced, I mean the cam is 6 crank-degrees ahead of the crank...that's 3 cam-degrees. Using a timing chain kit that allows for cam adv/ret, you just setup the gears to locate the cam 3deg ahead of where it would be if it was installed "straight-up" with no advance or retard the way a stock timing chain & gears would be. When working with those kits, you just have to be careful of whether their "advance" is in reference to the cam or the crank.
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Dave
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Post by Dave »

Chris,
How would the Explorer cam do if he wants to do a little off-roading but mostly street? I know that's what you have. Seems like he wants the power way down low and something inexpensive also.
Dave
'66'Ranchero 302/5 speed
2015 Stage 3 Roush - rated at 670 hp
2000 Ext Cab/4 door swap project
2000 Ext Cab/4 door, Summer beater
2000 Ext Cab/4 door, Winter beater
1969 Fairlane Cobra in Barn, just waiting
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Post by cee21 »

Right on Dave. Just don't want to lose power in one range to gain power in another. What about a cobra cam?
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Post by cgrey8 »

Explorer cam does ok. IMO, the motor's weak off-idle and the cam tends to lay down around 4500RPMs. It's still pulling at 5000RPMs, but there's no reason in taking it further. I get more torque shifting to the next gear rather than taking it any higher. At about 5500RPMs, the engine is rattling the valves and completely looses power (presumably floating them), that it gets a little disturbing. An aftermarket cam would hold strong well into 5500RPMs as well as giving a little more umph.

I don't know that the cam is going to do anything for off-idle torque though. About the only way to fix that is more displacement (i.e. stroker kit) or a nice roots supercharger.
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Post by 87ranger »

chris i dont quite agree with your "5,000rpm" assessment of the e cam, i think it will begin to walk away lower than that
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Post by cgrey8 »

To me, E cam refers to the E303. The E303 will pull well right to the high 5000s and 6000s if you got heads and intake to support it.

If you are referring to the Explorer cam, then that's what I was saying. It still has pull at 5000, but you are better off shifting than staying in the current gear. But there's benefit in riding it right to 5000...just not much over that. Again IMO...

The interesting and somewhat frustrating thing is the peak torque RPM occurs below my WOT shift pattern. With my stock Explorer motor, Torque seems to peak around 3400-3500RPM range. After that, it falls off. Fortunately it falls off slow enough that the RPMs keep the HP increasing. HP peaks in the 4500RPM range. Using my datalogs of WOT shifts, I've tried to figure out what RPM I need to shift at before the amount of HP I get from higher RPMs is less than what I'd get from shifting into a lower RPM. That RPM seems to be right around 5000-5100 range for my transmission. Technically, that target shift RPM is different for each gear since the separation between the gears is different from gear to gear (i.e. shift from 1st to 2nd drops the RPMs lower than a shift from 3rd to 4th). But I haven't gotten that sophisticated with it. After all, I'm not racing the truck (on the street nor on the track). I just drive it for fun to and from work...and I do LOVE driving my truck. In fact, I'm headed out to lunch now.
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89 Ranger Supercab, 331, ported GT40p heads w/1.6RRs, Crane Powermax 2020 cam, ported Explorer lower, FMS Explorer (GT40p) headers, aftermarket T5 'Z-Spec', 8.8" rear w/3.27s, Powertrax Locker, A9L w/Moates QuarterHorse, Innovate LC-1, James Duff traction bars, iDelta DC Fan controller

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Post by 87ranger »

im not refering to the explorer cam, im refering to the "E" CAM that ford sells under the name "E CAM"if i meant explorer i would have typed explorer
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